Genre-hopping DJ/producer Mat Zo is known for everything from DnB to dubstep to big room EDM and progressive house. And it's time for him to cook up his fantasy Forever Studio. Awkwardly, though, he pretty much has everything he needs already. Can we upsell the dreams of the Grammy-nominated producer? Listen to find out. Also, discover which outboard preamps he can't live without, which classic hardware synth he's always dreamed of owning and which single soft synth he could live with for eternity.
Will Betts:
Hi, I'm Will Betts.
Chris Barker:
And I'm Chris Barker and this is the MusicTech My Forever Studio Podcast.
Will Betts:
In this podcast we speak with producers, DJs, audio engineers and industry figureheads about their fantasy created space, their forever studio.
Chris Barker:
Yes. This studio must be built within the confines of our totally made up rules and it's one that they'll have to live with forever. Will, explain the rules.
Will Betts:
Okay. Our guest can select a computer, a DAW and an audio interface first and as an act of kindness, those are freebies because every studio needs them. But then our guest can only choose six pieces of studio gear and one luxury item.
Chris Barker:
Are there any other rules that our guests and listeners should know about, Will?
Will Betts:
You mean no bundles.
Chris Barker:
No bundles. That's right, no bundles.
Chris Barker:
Today, dialling in to build his forever studio is DJ and producer Matt Zo. In 2018, Matt's debut album Damage Control was released to critical acclaim and earned Matt a Grammy nomination. Known for producing a variety of styles, Matt is comfortable for producing gritty D&B, dubstep as he is making big room EDM and progressive house. Something that is also reflected in his own genreless Mat Zo label but will the limits of his forever studio make this genre-agnostic approach to production impossible?
Chris Barker:
Well let's see.
Will Betts:
Yes indeed. Let's unshackle ourselves from reality and find out. This is MusicTech's My Forever Studio with Matt Zo.
Chris Barker:
Welcome Matt.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, thank you for having me.
Chris Barker:
No, thanks for joining us. Three different timezones again. We're rocking it. Pandemic podcasting, that's what we do.
Matt Zo:
I'm used to this, it's perfect.
Chris Barker:
As you heard there, we've got some limits. We're looking at Matt now via a well known online conferencing platform and we can see that he already has lots of equipment in his studio so I feel this could potentially be quite challenging for you.
Matt Zo:
It is a bit, yeah.
Chris Barker:
But let's start with where you would put this fantasy forever studio in the world. As we would discuss before we started recording this, you're a well-travelled chap and have lived in many places and moved a lot. So where would you put your forever studio if you could be anywhere in the world?
Matt Zo:
That's a good question. I would probably put it somewhere rural. I don't think I would choose a city. I think it would be somewhere like Upstate Washington State or maybe somewhere in the desert. I like the idea of having a really remote studio, yeah.
Chris Barker:
So you're going for the US then? Definitely in the US because you've lived in the UK as well.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. I think I'd stay within my comfort zone of living in the US.
Chris Barker:
Okay.
Matt Zo:
For sure.
Chris Barker:
So somewhere rural. We're thinking woods rural or like you said, desert rural.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, exactly. One of the two for sure. Mountains, yeah.
Will Betts:
You're going to have to pick one Matt.
Matt Zo:
Oh, okay. All right. If I have to make a decision, I guess I'll say somewhere in Washington State forest, yeah. I feel like.
Chris Barker:
Okay, yeah. And then we're talking a cabin kind of situation here or?
Matt Zo:
I would want a pretty big studio with a live room and everything. So I don't know if we're talking a cabin but.
Will Betts:
Are we talking on a cliff, underpinned modernist style?
Matt Zo:
Actually it might be cool if it looked like cabin on the outside but on the inside, it was a super modern high-tech facility.
Chris Barker:
Here we go, here we go. It's started. You started off a bit shy to be wanting too much and now the shopping list has started to get there. Yeah, good.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. Yeah, you just fired some neurons.
Chris Barker:
We've got that situation and I guess the vibe like you said is old on the outside, modern on the inside. We can see into your studio that you're not going for the whole EDM spaceship studio though. It's a bit more chill. Would that be in your forever studio as well?
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
The same kind of vibe.
Matt Zo:
Definitely. Yeah, I always like working in a not so clean pristine environment. I need to have a bit of mess and yeah, toys lying around.
Chris Barker:
Yeah.
Matt Zo:
To inspire.
Will Betts:
So where you are right now, are you working with other people in your studio and would you be bringing other people into the forever studio? What are you thinking?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, yeah. Recently I've been doing a lot more collaborations. I just got a drum kit a few months ago so I've had drummers here doing drum takes and yeah. I would definitely-
Will Betts:
Does that explain the 100 mic stands behind you as well?
Matt Zo:
Yes, exactly. Yeah.
Chris Barker:
So then we've got the location sorted, we've got the vibe. I guess the first thing is the computer. Mac or PC?
Matt Zo:
Definitely PC. I've always been a PC guy.
Chris Barker:
That's a rare choice on the podcast.
Matt Zo:
I know.
Chris Barker:
Which is good. Tell us about why PC then?
Matt Zo:
I don't know, it's just what I'm used to. If I started on Macs, I would probably be using Macs still. But yeah, I like the workability of a PC. It's more of a workhorse to me than a Mac. Macs to me are media machines because I always use them as just an entertainment device.
Chris Barker:
So it's because you like to literally upgrade and modify Windows machines and PCs as well?
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
Is it that modular capability of them?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, exactly. I like the modular capability and I prefer the business ethics of Microsoft, I think over Apple as well.
Chris Barker:
See that's again something else that not many people consider. That's interesting, yeah. So we've got an ethical PC running this in a forever studio.
Matt Zo:
Somewhat.
Chris Barker:
Are you running DSP cards and that kind of thing in PCs? That's why you've got that.
Matt Zo:
Well no I don't have anything within the PC. I have an Apollo for DSP.
Will Betts:
And before we get to that, on the PC, you're allowed any PC ever. So what kind of spec are we taking? How beefed up is this thing going to be?
Matt Zo:
Right now I've got a 128 gigs of RAM and a pretty beefy CPU. I really like the setup that I have right now. I don't know how much I'd change it to be honest.
Will Betts:
You're not going to twist, you're going to stick?
Matt Zo:
I'm going to stick with the one I have actually, yeah.
Will Betts:
Okay, fine.
Matt Zo:
Stick with familiar.
Will Betts:
Fine, fine.
Chris Barker:
Do you ever hit CPU issues and track camp problems on this machine?
Matt Zo:
If I have a really crazy project, yeah. But yeah.
Will Betts:
How crazy do these projects get then? Do you ever max out your 128 gigabytes of RAM because that would be a very crazy project?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, very, very rarely. Only when there's really crazy sound design stuff happening within the actual project which is rare for me. I like doing things separated anyway as well.
Chris Barker:
We've got two more free items which is your DAW of choice and your audio interface of choice for your forever studio. Tell us about your DAW choice. Has it ever changed over the years and what's it going to be in the forever studio?
Matt Zo:
Yeah. Well I started on Logic when it was for PC. So that gives you an idea.
Will Betts:
Deep cut.
Matt Zo:
And then I moved to FruityLoops and now I'm on Ableton and I don't think I'd switch from Ableton honestly. I like the quick workflow of Ableton. It might not be the most professional DAW for tracking but I find ways around it and yeah, I think the speed of it really makes ups for everything that it lacks.
Will Betts:
When you say the speed of it, what do you mean exactly?
Matt Zo:
Just being able to drag a loop in and you can easily warp it to the tempo. Yeah, there's certain workflow things like the audio effect rack in Ableton. Being able to do parallel processing within one channel without having to route it out to another channel. It just saves me so much time.
Will Betts:
And is that something you're doing a lot then in your productions then, Matt?
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah, tonnes. Yeah, every single project I'm using that feature.
Will Betts:
Wowzas, all right.
Chris Barker:
The audio interface is the next free item.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. I'm sorry the first half of this interview is boring because I think I would still go for the same one that I have. I've got a USB midi fin.
Will Betts:
What?
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
You've already peaked. You've already peaked in your career, you've got all the stuff you need. You're sure we can't
Speaker 4:
Upsell your dreams.
Chris Barker:
Upsell some of your dreams?
Matt Zo:
Maybe. Maybe I would get a really nice AD/DA converter. A Lynx or something.
Chris Barker:
Okay.
Matt Zo:
So yeah. But I like the USB midi Digiface. I just got it, I forgot what it's called. It's the one with four AD/DA ins and outs and you just plug other interfaces into it.
Will Betts:
Oh, that's cool. Is that the RME Digiface?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, the RME Digiface. That's the one.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, RME is a popular choice on the podcast. Robust, reliable.
Will Betts:
Yeah. With no mic ins on the Digiface. So how you going to?
Matt Zo:
Well it works with my existing setup because I originally had the Focusrite 18i20 and I bought a few other AD/DA compatible interfaces to be able to plug into it. So it's a modular scattered design. But actually yeah, I'd probably go for a Lynx AD/DA if I had the money for that.
Will Betts:
Yes. Dream upsold.
Chris Barker:
Is that the single interface? The Lynx doesn't have pres either, does it? So it's just straight conversion.
Matt Zo:
No. That would bring me onto one of my gear choices.
Chris Barker:
Ah, okay. Well here we go, here we go. So we're going with the Lynx in the forever studio and then we're moving onto item number one. These are not free, you get six of these.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, okay. So is a console included in one of these items because that's very-
Chris Barker:
Console is one item, that's fine.
Matt Zo:
Okay well then I would definitely have a SSL of some sort. A B or a G-series.
Chris Barker:
Oh, going vintage? So not a duality. You're going-
Matt Zo:
No, yeah. You know, I haven't actually played around on one of those in real life so I'd have to do a few.
Chris Barker:
We need a choice Matt.
Matt Zo:
Okay.
Will Betts:
Pick one. What's it going to be? E or G?
Matt Zo:
G, G. I would go for the G.
Chris Barker:
I would have gone for the G. Good. Yeah, yeah.
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Will Betts:
And how big, how big are we talking? Do you need to have like 96 channels?
Matt Zo:
Oh no. No, no. I'd only need like 16, I think. Nothing too crazy.
Will Betts:
It's only got 16 inputs so that makes sense.
Chris Barker:
That's a very boutique G-series isn't it? 16 channels G-series. If there's any of those floating around in real life, that's cool.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, yeah. 32 if I can't find a small one.
Chris Barker:
Nice.
Will Betts:
But you'll make do with a 32. So it's very noble of you to take that bullet.
Matt Zo:
Well you're giving me free reign here so.
Chris Barker:
Yup. Upsell your dreams, do whatever. It's fine.
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. So why SSL though? You said you've not used the G or the E but have you used SSL? You like the sound of SSL?
Matt Zo:
Yeah. I think it's more oriented for mixing which is more of my thing. If I want good pres for a live recording, I'd probably do something outboard. So yeah, I think it would suit my purposes.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. And they're not bad pres are they? On the old G-series. It's fine.
Matt Zo:
Right, exactly. But yeah, they're not known for-
Chris Barker:
Good.
Will Betts:
Pretty great still, yeah.
Matt Zo:
Being specifically good for recording but they are great for mixing.
Will Betts:
And so you'd be tracking your drum kit through that and any guest vocalists?
Matt Zo:
Yeah. As I said, I'd probably use some outboard pres for specific things but for mixing like doing hybrid mixing, I think I'd use a SSL, yeah.
Will Betts:
And so do you have any Control Surface right now or are you doing everything in the box? How does it compare to what you have?
Matt Zo:
Right now I do all my mixing in the box. I try and do as much recording out of the box in terms of pres and stuff. Or at least out of my interfaces.
Chris Barker:
Interfaces plural. I like that, it's good.
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Will Betts:
Is that part of a everything needs to be plugged in at all times mentality or what? Why do you have so many interfaces?
Matt Zo:
I think it's a case of I bought one interface and then I wanted the Apollo for its DSP. So now I have two interfaces that I don't want to get rid of because I like them. So how can I just plug all my interfaces into one? It's just simple out of necessity to have more pres but I didn't want to get rid of my existing gear.
Chris Barker:
I would really enjoy if this episode of the podcast was just six different interfaces in each use. That would be a very unique My Forever Studio.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. Why not?
Chris Barker:
Just Ableton and six interfaces.
Will Betts:
And no instruments.
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, no instruments. Yes, yes. That's fine. All right then Will. So we've got the SSL, item number one. What about item number two. What are you going next?
Matt Zo:
I think I'd go for a CS-80.
Chris Barker:
Okay. I'm just going to put it out there Matt. You don't have any speakers or headphones at this point as well so just.
Matt Zo:
Oh, I didn't realise that's also part of it.
Chris Barker:
That's just a little clue before you get to item number six and you can't hear anything.
Matt Zo:
Okay. In that case, again I'm going to be boring and go for the Hedd Type 20s.
Chris Barker:
Oh, okay.
Matt Zo:
For speakers.
Chris Barker:
That's cool.
Matt Zo:
Because those are ones that I already have and I think they're amazing. For the price they are, I think they're the best speakers I've ever heard.
Chris Barker:
So again, we can't upsell you on some big, massive gigantic monitors? You like the Hedd. The Hedds are relatively recent, when did you get them?
Matt Zo:
Three years ago, yeah.
Chris Barker:
Okay. And where you on ADAMs or another type of?
Matt Zo:
Yeah. I was on ADAMs before that and just the Rokit. It's behind me there.
Chris Barker:
Yeah.
Matt Zo:
But yeah, I think the Hedds are really, really accurate but also not too fatiguing and yeah, I just love them. I wouldn't change them for the world.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. For anybody listening, the real lower end of that Hedd range as well is really great value like the little five inch desktop things, they sound amazing for the cash. They're really, really good. And Hedds, it's the guy that helped design the Tweeter for ADAM, right?
Matt Zo:
Exactly. So I think the Tweeters and these sound better than the ADAMs because he's had time to upgrade them.
Chris Barker:
Okay. And they're made in Germany, right?
Matt Zo:
Yup.
Chris Barker:
Rather than I think the ADAMs became eventually made in China or they moved production.
Matt Zo:
Oh, I don't know about that.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, there was-
Will Betts:
For some of their series, I think. For some of the more affordable stuff.
Chris Barker:
We are not to say but there was lots of talk whether that impacted on quality control of the speakers but ADAM is still a hugely popular choice as well.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. Still have my ADAM A7Xs here for reference. So yeah.
Chris Barker:
I was just going to say the A7Xs, they're ubiquitous. You see them everywhere. They're like the new NS-10, aren't they? They're everywhere.
Matt Zo:
I was going to say they are my NS-10s. They take the place of that, yeah.
Chris Barker:
So we've got the Hedds as item number two and then-
Will Betts:
Before we go on though, can I just ask. Can we upsell you to the Type 30 from the Type 20 or are you going to?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, yeah. I'd go...
Will Betts:
Okay, okay..
Chris Barker:
Upsold dreams, Will? Upsold dreams.
SFX:
Upsell your dreams.
Will Betts:
Yes.
Chris Barker:
There it is.
Will Betts:
We like this.
Chris Barker:
Type 30, great. Item number three. At the beginning of item number two there before we talked speakers, you said CS-80. Is that item number three then, the CS-80?
Matt Zo:
Yes, for sure. I think it's definitely one of the best synths ever made. Way ahead of its time with its holophonic after touch. The sounds that you could get out of that are insane and yeah, there's a reason why it's one of the most expensive synths on the market.
Chris Barker:
So have you played one in real life?
Matt Zo:
No, unfortunately.
Chris Barker:
Do you have one, do you have any of the CS range?
Matt Zo:
I only have the plugins but even with the plugins, it sounds amazing but I just know that if I had a real CS-80, I would never not use it on every single project I did.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. And obviously the forever studio comes with complete reliability of these items as well so one of them in good condition working is like you say, they're a dream to play and they're crazy mind blowing. So CS-80, item number three. And we've still only got Ableton software wise. And as we can see from your studio behind you, you generally do outboard then. You're not doing plugin synths?
Matt Zo:
No. I do a lot of in the box stuff. That's how I started so that's what I'm comfortable with. Everything you see behind me besides the MS-20 is a pretty new acquisition. The MS-20 I've had for a while just because it's a good first synth I think. But yeah, I've only really started dabbling out of the box in the last two or three years.
Chris Barker:
Okay. And is that MS-20 the reissue or it is an original one?
Matt Zo:
It's a reissue, yeah.
Chris Barker:
Reissue.
Matt Zo:
The [crosstalk 00:17:44].
Chris Barker:
They're great, aren't they?
Matt Zo:
Yeah. They still sound good.
Chris Barker:
So what's that Will? Where are we at now? Item number four?
Will Betts:
We are three in, we've got three left.
Chris Barker:
Three left. Halfway through.
Matt Zo:
Since this is a dream studio and everything's working perfectly. I would say Fairchild but I'm guessing a lot of people say that.
Chris Barker:
I think we've had it a couple of times but not as much.
Matt Zo:
I'm surprised.
Chris Barker:
CS-80 for sure for that synth.
Matt Zo:
Right. Yeah that's not surprising.
Chris Barker:
Fairchild.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I'd definitely go for a Fairchild. It's just a classic great all-round compressor that has a unique character that you couldn't get with a plugin, I think.
Chris Barker:
That's an expensive signal pass, isn't it? CS-80 through the Fairchild into an SSL-G. That's good.
Matt Zo:
Again you're giving me free reign here so I might as well go for gold, right?
Chris Barker:
Yes, perfect.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, Fairchild. It's for the history, I think. It would be like having a little museum piece in my studio as well.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, nice. And we don't have a mic yet.
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah.
Chris Barker:
But if you do record any drums or whatever, smashing it through that. Brilliant.
Will Betts:
And so are you using any emulations of Fairchild at the moment? Does that appear anywhere? Tell us more.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, yeah. I use the UAD one a lot.
Chris Barker:
Ah, okay. That's the introduction to the Fairchild for you or have you had one in real life at some point?
Matt Zo:
No, I've never had one in real life. I watch a lot of YouTube comparisons though. And also I think the history of gear adds to the inspiration of a studio. I know it would sound better but really it's just about being inspired, being surrounded by beautiful pieces of equipment is nice.
Chris Barker:
No, it totally is. And I think like you say with consoles and stuff, there's still that value in that centrepiece. We've said this before on another episode but it's that kind of centrepiece and it feeling like it's professional, it's work. It's every impression you've had of a recording studio since growing up is that big console and walking in and seeing that and going, "We're in a recording studio now, we're going to make music." And weirdly, even though it might not be important technically to the process and making music anymore, it's like you say, it's that vibe and energy of having those things around that make a difference.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, exactly. It's a psychological thing I think.
Chris Barker:
Well totally. Looking at your studio behind you, it's the same thing. It's like, "Oh right, let's go and play on that stuff." Whereas if they were all plugins buried on the computer, it's a different experience to just being able to walk over to stuff.
Matt Zo:
Exactly. Yeah, I didn't enjoy being in my studio as much when I would just sit down at my desk and type away like a day job.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, like an office job. Exactly, yeah.
Matt Zo:
Right, exactly.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. It doesn't look like you're in an office anymore, that's very cool. Is that some kind of lute as well behind you?
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah, that's a Baglama. It's a very cheap Baglama.
Chris Barker:
Nice.
Matt Zo:
But it's a Turkish instrument. I love Middle Eastern music so I try and incorporate that.
Chris Barker:
And do you play?
Matt Zo:
No. I play guitar so I can just figure it out and stuff.
Chris Barker:
That and the magic of multiple takes in Ableton, you can get something good.
Matt Zo:
Right, exactly.
Will Betts:
If you're into music production, you should also check out MusicTech Magazine. In this month's issue, we tell the story of Native Instruments' MASCHINE tracing it from its origins through to the latest revolutionary standalone version, the MASCHINE+ which requires no computer whatsoever to operate and we put it through its paces. In our interview section, we sit down with producer Hillier to learn about his work with Blur and Depeche Mode. We talk to Wendy & Lisa, the core of Prince's band, The Revolution about gender equality, gear and scoring for TV. Plus we find out why German electronic icon, Michael Rother of Neu! is so surprised to be making music. We also give our verdict on a huge array of new products including iZotope RX 8, the Akai MPK mini MK3 and the Aston Element, a new hybrid mic with a voicing decided by public vote. Beyond that, we have a stack of tutorials for Cubase, FL Studio, Logic, Live and Studio One. You'll find all that and more in the November 2020 issue of MusicTech Magazine. Subscribe now at MusicTech.net.
Chris Barker:
So at number five.
Will Betts:
Up to number five, yeah.
Chris Barker:
Sorry, I always get distracted on this.
Will Betts:
Yeah, no, no.
Chris Barker:
And move my chain on the list. Will, Will.
Will Betts:
I can keep you on the [crosstalk 00:22:17].
Chris Barker:
Keeping on the steady road of My Forever Studio.
Will Betts:
Before we get to number five, can you tell us a little bit more about choice number four, your Fairchild choice. What are you using that on when you're making tracks and when you're mixing?
Matt Zo:
Well the emulation I use when I'm doing sound design a lot. I'll put all my synths through that and maybe through the Studer tape plugin as well just to make it sound a little bit less digital. But yeah, I think if I had a real one, I'd be using it on recording. Definitely running drums through it.
Chris Barker:
So when you say sound design for synths, I guess you're using it to control say maybe multiple layers of synth and make them squash together a little bit.
Matt Zo:
Exactly. Yup, exactly.
Chris Barker:
Ah, okay. Cool, cool, cool.
Will Betts:
Are you using it as a colour box as well or are you trying to get that vibe from it? Not necessarily in terms of dynamics but the tonal things as well.
Matt Zo:
Exactly. The little subtle non-linearities.
Will Betts:
Okay, number five then. Number five. You've got two left Matt. What the hell are you going to have now?
Matt Zo:
Well I haven't got a mic yet so let's think. Most of the stuff I've been saying is just off the top of my head because I didn't actually realise there was a premise for this pod until like a few minutes before.
Chris Barker:
That's exactly what we like though when it's springed.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. So for mics, I don't think I'd go for a standard Neumann U 67 or something like that. I think I'd go for a Josephson.
Chris Barker:
I need to be straight on Google, I don't know this one. Tell us about this.
Matt Zo:
Simply based on watching Steve Albini rave on about them and how good his recordings sound.
Chris Barker:
Okay.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I like the idea of having a really modern workhorse mic rather than a classic Neumann. Yeah. So let me see.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. I think you've got enough vintage vibes with the SSL and the Fairchild and the CS-80.
Matt Zo:
Exactly. I want something more all-round for a mic.
Will Betts:
So do you know which one you're after? Is it a large diaphragm condenser you're looking at or something else?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, definitely. If I can only choose one mic.
Will Betts:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
Well you've got another item if you want two mics.
Matt Zo:
Maybe there would be two mics then because I think I would go for a ribbon mic and a large diaphragm condenser.
Chris Barker:
So you've got two mics. Well we'll do the rundown in a minute if you're going to do two mics as your final two items.
Will Betts:
This is fast and loose. I've never seen anybody play the game quite like this so I'm excited.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. How do people usually do this?
Chris Barker:
I think what usually happens though Matt is Will will run down the entire list once you get to the end and then you'll change your mind on loads of items.
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah, that probably will happen. So I'd probably go for the Josephson's C700, their multi-pattern one. Because that one, it comes with two XLRs but you can bounce the two and you can get more of a proximity effect or less depending on how you blend the two signals. So that would be super useful.
Chris Barker:
That's almost like two mics in one, isn't it? That's very cool.
Matt Zo:
Exactly.
Will Betts:
That's allowed and we've allowed the sphere before so that doesn't fall into the bundle.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, it's not a bundle.
Will Betts:
No, it's not a bundle.
Chris Barker:
No, yeah.
Will Betts:
No it's not.
Chris Barker:
It's not, It's not.
Will Betts:
It's fine, it's fine.
Chris Barker:
So we're on the last item. Item number six. Is it going to be another mic or?
Matt Zo:
I might have to think about this one.
Chris Barker:
So you have no software apart from Ableton. Just [crosstalk 00:26:18] stock in Ableton.
Matt Zo:
I don't have any pres. Yeah. I think I'd have to get a pre of some sort.
Chris Barker:
Okay. So the G-series pre is not doing it for you?
Matt Zo:
Well it's good for some things but if I want something specific.
Will Betts:
How specific, what are we talking about here?
Matt Zo:
A really good vocal pre or something like I have an Avalon 737 here and what I would really like is two of them but I can't have two more items, can I?
Chris Barker:
Just one more, one more.
Will Betts:
One more.
Matt Zo:
Just one more. There's the stereo version of this, the 747. I would get that.
Chris Barker:
Loophole.
Will Betts:
Yeah, loophole.
Matt Zo:
It's no bundles but what do you classify as a bundle? It's everything. A console is technically a bundle.
Will Betts:
This is fine, this is fine. Yeah.
Chris Barker:
No that's not a bundle. We put the bundle rule in place so people didn't buy the massive Waves whatever bundle and then have a 1000 plugins in one go or the Slate bundles. Those are the bundles that make us angry in the My Forever Studio because they're not one item, that's a lot of items and it ruins our show ultimately. So we had to put that [crosstalk 00:27:35].
Matt Zo:
Well I'll make it easy for you. I won't get any of those.
Will Betts:
It makes us incredibly angry. Okay.
Matt Zo:
I'll just go for a 747, Avalon 747.
Will Betts:
But yeah, knowing there's stereo mics and stereo pres and things, that's fine. Didn't the Strongroom guys have a stereo Neve thing that we hadn't seen before?
Chris Barker:
I think it was Drew Bang had an 1178.
Will Betts:
1178, yes.
Chris Barker:
Which is a stereo 1176, yeah. It's an unusual one.
Will Betts:
So yeah, knowledge is power on knowing those little rare bits of kitware. You get double for the money.
Chris Barker:
Now so I'm not seeing a 747 here. I'm concerned Matt that you've made this up and you're trying to game us here.
Matt Zo:
Wait, what? I swear I saw. My lack of knowledge is really showing here.
Chris Barker:
No, no, no. Looks like there must be a stereo version. Ah yeah, the AD2022 Dual Mono Pure Class A Preamplifier. I'm definitely not reading that off the internet.
Matt Zo:
Avalon stereo-
Chris Barker:
That's two Class A channels.
Matt Zo:
If I have Google, I'm going to use it. Avalons Pure Preamp.
Will Betts:
Hey guys, we've got a new preamp to launch. Has anybody got a name for it? Yeah, give me a second.
Matt Zo:
They had I swear I saw there was a stereo version. Did I dream about this?
Chris Barker:
It wouldn't be beyond the realms of reality-
Matt Zo:
It's very possible.
Chris Barker:
For somebody in this industry to dream about stereo preamp. That is literally upselling your own dreams in your dreams in your dreams.
Will Betts:
In your dreams.
Matt Zo:
I am very confused. I swear. Oh yeah, the 82. Yeah, it's just not called that.
Chris Barker:
You can have it.
Matt Zo:
Wait, there's another one. The M5. Yeah, I'd probably get it, the M5.
Will Betts:
M5. Okay.
Chris Barker:
So it's just the Avalon M5. That's actually snappier than the name that you had, Will before which was-
Matt Zo:
The 747, was it not? Just the name of a plane.
Will Betts:
Yeah. Stereo play in two floors.
Chris Barker:
Well okay. So the Avalon M5.
Matt Zo:
Yeah. I have the 737 and it's just a great all round classic preamp and I would love to have two of them and I think the M5 is the closest thing to that.
Chris Barker:
Is the 737... I need to Google but that's the classic silver thing with the central sort of-
Matt Zo:
Yup, Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Chris Barker:
Yeah. So almost a bit of an industry standard, now that Avalon, isn't it?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I see it everywhere now.
Will Betts:
But it's got a tube preamp and opto compressors in it. So are you not going to want something that's a bit more of a channel strip or will you run that into a line input on your SSL and then use all that [crosstalk 00:30:32].
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I would use other compressors. The compression on this is good but it's only good for some things, I think. So yeah, I mainly love it for the quality of its preamp. So yeah, I think I would like two of them.
Will Betts:
Two of them, okay.
Matt Zo:
For my final choice.
Chris Barker:
Nice. Okay well Will, can you run us down what we've got so far. Where we are and what the studio looks like and then we'll move on to the final luxury item unless there are any panic changes when you hear the list.
Will Betts:
I feel like there will be because you can't possibly be making all of your electronic music with just the stock plugins in Ableton or are you?
Chris Barker:
And the CS-8- though.
Matt Zo:
Yup.
Will Betts:
Oh he's got a CS-80? Okay yeah< I'll take it all back. Fine.
Chris Barker:
Do the list, let's picture it, let's picture it out.
Will Betts:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, okay. We're in the woods in rural Washington State. It's old and rustic on the outside but it's pristine and modern on the inside but with a friendly vibe. So the computer is a PC with a 128 gigabytes of RAM presumably cooled with liquid nitrogen or something similar. It's got to be upsold. But you have Ableton for your DAW for it's parallel processing abilities. Your interface is a Lynx Aurora and then in the studio you have your six items are an SSL G-series, a 16 channel. Listening back on Hedd Type 30 four way speakers. You have a beautiful, perfectly kept Yamaha CS-80, a Fairchild compressor. A 670 I'm going to say just because you want the stereo obviously. The Josephson C700 stereo multi pattern condenser and an Avalon M5 dual preamp.
Matt Zo:
I think that sounds like a good combination but you're right, I don't have any plugins.
Will Betts:
Oh no. Oh no Matt, what's going to go?
Matt Zo:
Oh no.
Will Betts:
What will you sub in?
Matt Zo:
I can't have a bundle, I have to choose one. Can that be my luxury item? That's not really a luxury item.
Chris Barker:
It's not. Luxury items are non studio gear related. We're looking for something else. I think that's a pretty solid studio though. The CS-80 and an Ableton resampling potential, I think you're all right sound design, right?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I think so. I think yeah, it's got a ring modulator on it, it's got white noise generators. Yeah, I could do most of the sound design that I do in the box with a CS-80 I reckon.
Chris Barker:
So when you say sound design in the box, you haven't got anymore items but what were you considering if you were going to get a soft synth or something for sound design. What feels like it's missing?
Matt Zo:
Well I'd have to get an instance of Phase Plant for sure.
Chris Barker:
Okay.
Matt Zo:
That's my favourite synth. I couldn't live without Phase Plant.
Chris Barker:
Oh, okay. Well you're going to have to unless you're going to swap it out.
Matt Zo:
Oh no. Am I really going to have to give up the Avalon? Yeah I think I'll have to switch out the Avalon for a Phase Plant. Let's do it.
Chris Barker:
And just rely on those boring SSL amazing preamps and the G-series.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, tit for tat.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. So Phase Plant, right?
Matt Zo:
Yup. Okay, okay. So we swapped.
Chris Barker:
So what is it about Phase Plant. When did you start using it and what did you use before that? What was the change.
Matt Zo:
Well Serum was my go to before that which everybody knows but Phase Plant's great because like Serum where you have all the FM routing and AM routing but you can have pretty much as many oscillators as you want. I think there's a limit to a 100 oscillators or something ridiculous. It's fully modular within a plugin and the variety of sounds you can get out of it is insane. I do all my drum design for instance, in Phase Plant now.
Chris Barker:
Oh wow.
Matt Zo:
So yeah. I use it for everything.
Chris Barker:
That's a heady bit of programming to do all of the drum sound design there, okay.
Will Betts:
That's why he needs the liquid nitrogen in his computer.
Matt Zo:
Exactly.
Chris Barker:
Oh, yeah. True. True, true, true. For all of those 100 oscillators all at the same time.
Matt Zo:
It's amazing though. Phase Plant, it will run all those 100 oscillators and it won't even dent CPU even on a not so good machine. Try it out for yourselves if anyone's got Phase Plant. Try and max your Phase Plant, it's really fun. It's a fun exercise to do.
Will Betts:
So when you have an instance of Phase Plant then for each drum element. So you have a Phase Plant for kicks and for snares and for the hats or whatever.
Matt Zo:
I'd have multiple instances for each drum element. At least for the kick and snare or clap or whatever.
Will Betts:
So how are you layering those up then? Tell us about your process.
Matt Zo:
So my general rule is that I'll keep my transients pretty clean and then I'll have more layers for the tail of a drum. So I'll use little bits of white noise or an oscillator modulated with white noise with some attack on the BA to make some room for the transient and then I'll have just a bunch of different tail layers after that which I can process in crazy ways.
Chris Barker:
And are you committing these to audio and then resampling and layering up or are you generally running them all live?
Matt Zo:
Sometimes. It depends on what I'm making but a lot of the time now, I'm just doing everything in the project like having all my drum layers playing as midi basically.
Chris Barker:
Do you ever get option paralysis because you can constantly tweak and it's all midi and live as such you can be like, "Oh, maybe it's."
Matt Zo:
Yeah, I'm familiar with that but that's why I do everything else. I try and commit to audio as soon as possible like with the musical elements. But with drums, I like to have options and be able to change it later especially for dance music and electronic music. I feel like that's really one of the most important aspects of it is the drum sound.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, I suppose that's the fundamental. Yeah, dance music doesn't exist without drums really. I don't think anybody's ever done that yet, have they? Had a hit club record that doesn't have any drums on it.
Matt Zo:
Maybe Sophie but yeah. The principals though.
Chris Barker:
I guess within a DJ set though, it would just feel like a really long breakdown, wouldn't it?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, exactly.
Chris Barker:
So the luxury item. Now the luxury item is non gear related. We're thinking often it's something that people after they've moved houses and studios. It's something that's always in their studio or because we can upsell their dreams, it could be something ridiculous that you would love to have in your studio as a luxury item and yeah. Tell us what's coming into your head straight away then we can-
Matt Zo:
What's coming to my head straight away is very boring utilitarian just having a massive screen. But that's not really a luxury item.
Will Betts:
Oh you can have that. That's included, that's part of your computer setup.
Matt Zo:
Okay, okay.
Will Betts:
You're allowed that.
Chris Barker:
Yeah.
Will Betts:
And do you have a giant screen right now. Is that why you say that.
Matt Zo:
I have a two screen setup which is okay but I think having just a big wall of screen would be really cool.
Chris Barker:
Like some kind of Wall Street guy.
Matt Zo:
Exactly.
Chris Barker:
Just a different instance of Phase Plant on every screen. Just aaah. Yeah.
Matt Zo:
Yup. Exactly.
Chris Barker:
Yeah, like Will says though. Things like that, they come as a part of the studio. You need the screens, you need a chair, you need a desk.
Will Betts:
I'd include all of that.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. Something more personal perhaps.
Matt Zo:
Definitely a playground for my cat.
Chris Barker:
A cat playground. That is a good item.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, yeah. Because I can't tell you the amount of times that my cat bothers me while I produce. I would love for him to have a distraction to go and play off on.
Will Betts:
That's a new one, yeah.
Matt Zo:
And also, it would make for good sound deadening.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. Those kinds of scratching post maze kind of things where they... Isn't it called a cat tree or did I just make that up?
Matt Zo:
Yeah, no. A cat tree, yeah. I think that's what it's called. But I'd have a giant one that covers the whole back wall that they could use a gym.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. And it would be like an acoustic trim. You could get one that is slightly modular where you could add different elements, put around the drum kit.
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah, yeah.
Chris Barker:
Yeah.
Matt Zo:
You could change things around, yeah.
Chris Barker:
Actually it might be quite terrifying if the cat's on there and then somebody starts playing drums though.
Matt Zo:
Yeah, respect to the cat if it still manages to stick around. So yeah.
Will Betts:
Also they're notoriously sound deadening. They absorb all the sound.
Matt Zo:
Exactly. My cat's a pretty big cat, I think it could be used as a baffle.
Will Betts:
A moving baffle, a constantly moving baffle.
Chris Barker:
Baffle is a great name for a cat as well.
Matt Zo:
I think that yeah.
Chris Barker:
It's a great name.
Matt Zo:
I'm going to rename him.
Chris Barker:
Baffle.
Matt Zo:
Come here Baffle.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. Yeah, Baffle is a nice name. Okay so that's the forever studio Matt. Thanks so much for coming on the show and-
Matt Zo:
Yeah, thank you.
Will Betts:
And entertaining this madness frankly.
Chris Barker:
And entertaining this madness and especially as you weren't really prepared for it and we just went, "Right, okay, this is what we're doing." So you've got some new music coming out though as well, right? What's coming up for you. It's been strange times but there is still music happening, right?
Matt Zo:
Yes, yes. I have got an album coming out in October called Illusion of Depth and it's coming out on Anjunabeats. Yeah, I made it before the pandemic when I was trying to make more dance floor orientated music so it's very clubby. More clubby than my previous stuff, I'd say. Which yeah, works out great for now.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. Well everyone get into it and get ready for when the virus has been tamed or something next year and we're probably all back into it. Are you missing being out performing and that kind of stuff?
Matt Zo:
I'm definitely missing playing music for people for sure. But I'm also doing virtual events in Minecraft. So yeah.
Chris Barker:
Oh yeah, this is something you've done for a long time, right?
Matt Zo:
Not that long. A few months now but I've been playing Minecraft for a long time but only started doing events recently and yeah, they've been doing pretty well. So it's not the same, it will never be quite as invigorating.
Chris Barker:
Can I put a request in for you to build your forever studio in Minecraft? That would be nice.
Matt Zo:
Oh yeah, I've already done that many times out of just pure boredom.
Chris Barker:
Okay, yeah. Yeah. A Minecraft CS-80 sounds cool.
Matt Zo:
Yeah.
Chris Barker:
Yeah. Nice. Right well that's My Forever Studio with Matt Zo. Thank you so much for joining us
Matt Zo:
Yeah, thank you for having me. It was really fun.
Will Betts:
If you're enjoying the podcast, make sure you subscribe using your favourite podcasting app and give us a glowing review and a five star rating.
Chris Barker:
Joining us next time is ornithological dance icon, Claude VonStroke.
Will Betts:
Indeed. The DirtyBird Records founder and gear head will be spec-ing up his fantasy forever studio but what will he choose?
Chris Barker:
Well you'll have to tune in to find out.
Will Betts:
Thanks very much for listening and catch you next week.